Brand & Demand: Building a Data-Driven Modern Marketing Organization

Kate Price, Partner at Prophet speaks with Caroline Chulick, Head of U.S. Marketing at Hill’s Pet Nutrition about how to drive more return on investment (ROI) with your marketing.  

Caroline Chulick is the Head of U.S. Marketing at Hill’s Pet Nutrition, a subsidiary of Colgate-Palmolive, where she leads brand strategy, media, data & analytics, integrated commerce and public relations for a premium pet food business. 

Kate Price: Given the increased focus on accountability and ROI in marketing, how has your experience been, and what shifts have you observed in your approach to demonstrate impact? 

Caroline Chulick: In my 20 years at Colgate-Palmolive, there has been a consistent strategic focus and commitment to driving ROI and measurement. However, recently there has been a noticeable shift in expectations and the way we approach demonstrating impact. With increased investment in brand building, there is greater rigor in tracking where these investments go. The key lies in aligning investments, tactics, and the entire funnel with well-defined business goals in the planning phase. The C-suite places trust in the marketing team to deliver results, but there is certainly a heightened expectation for faster feedback cycles. The cadence for presenting outcomes has increased, particularly in short-term, behavior-driven data, requiring a faster test-learn-pivot cycle. For marketing to be successful, educating senior leaders on evolving marketing approaches and technologies is a crucial aspect. There’s a general acceptance around continuous learning and our leaders understand that the traditional approaches may not be effective in the current landscape. And, we’ve found that they are always excited to learn more. 

KP: Within your organization, how has cross-functional collaboration evolved, especially in terms of partnering with other internal business units? 

CC: In the realm of CPG marketing, cross-functional collaboration has always been fundamental. However, the transformation lies in how this collaboration has evolved, particularly in the past three years. The game-changer is the increasing maturity of data within the organization. While traditional collaboration involved departments such as supply chain, sales, finance and legal, the difference now is the profound impact of data across every facet of the organization. Data-driven partnerships have become the norm, influencing how we go to market in areas like warehousing, frontline sales and end-user interactions. 

As an example, we initiated a data partnership for media purposes, which unexpectedly transformed how we approached veterinary clinics in our sales strategy. The newfound data visibility allowed us to discern critical differences between two seemingly similar clinics. Through our data, we discovered that Clinic A was loyal to our brand and distinct from Clinic B, which was also ordered just as much from a competitor. This revelation reshaped how we engaged with each clinic, providing tailored conversations and sales strategies. The availability of this data has revolutionized not only how we approach the market, but also how we tier and equip our salesforce for more effective interactions. 

These evolving dynamics in B2B marketing showcase the potential for leveraging data to achieve precise, personalized interactions akin to the one-to-one marketing approach in the consumer space. 

KP: We published a report call Brand and Demand: A Love Story which talks about the tension between the two functions. How do you balance your brand and demand marketing investments? 

CC: The dynamic between brand and demand is a nuanced one for us. Brand, which has traditionally been associated with long-term equity building, now intertwines with demand, which is focused on short-term actions. For us, the two are interlinked, and we’ve observed that our short-term (ROI) for brand building is as impactful, if not more, than it is for product-specific initiatives. Our data-driven approach allows us to find a unique balance, where we test and optimize the mix to align with our brand’s specific strengths and audience penetration. For us, it’s the strategic fusion of both that typically yield the best outcomes. 

An important component for creating an optimal balance is our team dynamics. Physical collaboration spaces and a culture of curiosity and continuous learning have been key in breaking down silos and fostering cross-functional collaboration. Our team operates with a shared understanding that we’re not just building a product; we’re crafting a brand, a lifestyle, and a connection with our audience. This distinction motivates our team, aligning their efforts to build equity and deliver a meaningful brand experience. The nature of our category, focused on pets and families, adds a layer of emotional engagement, creating a sense of purpose for our team.  

We’ve also shifted our key performance indicators (KPIs) to encourage collaborative achievements, reinforcing that synergies between different strengths and focuses lead to more impactful outcomes. My role as a leader involves connecting these dots, facilitating collaboration and removing any barriers the teams encounter. 

KP: In the report, we found that there are four common principles of brand and demand: anchoring marketing investment in business objectives, experimentation, building a modern marketing organization and putting the customer at the center. Do you agree with these and how do you apply these to your organization? 

CC: I do agree with these principles. Anchoring our marketing investment in business objectives is a fundamental principle that we actively embrace. Each year, we set ambitious goals, some with a short-term focus and others with a strategic, three-to-five-year horizon. The key lies in translating these objectives into actionable plans through what we call a brand growth plan. This plan serves as our roadmap, and KPIs are the compass guiding our progress. The process involves a continuous cycle of testing, learning, and pivoting, ensuring we stay agile and effective in achieving our business objectives. 

As it relates to experimentation, it is not just encouraged. but ingrained in our culture. I recall a valuable lesson several years ago from an executive leader and mentor that came while I was working on a new direct-to-consumer project. He actually urged me to fail! The rationale was clear: if we’re not failing, we’re not pushing the company beyond its comfort zone. Failure isn’t a setback; it’s a sign that we’re challenging the status quo. Experimentation, accompanied by a willingness to fail, is vital for growth and innovation. 

Building a modern marketing organization requires a dynamic approach. In my three years in the current role, I’ve repeatedly recognized the need to adapt our organizational structure. The pace of change and growth demands a constant pulse on the people, structure, tools, and resources within the organization. 

Being customer-centric is not just a philosophy; it’s a way of life in our organization. Every initiative, product, or experience starts with a customer insight or a pain point that needs addressing. The commitment is to solve problems or make lives easier, ensuring that each effort is purpose-driven. 

KP: What excites you about the market in the next couple of years, and how are you preparing your organization for upcoming shifts? 

CC: What excites me most about the future are strategic partnerships and a focus on audience-first planning. We are actively seeking unconventional partnerships across the pet space, expanding our role from a nutrition company to a comprehensive pet health solution. Additionally, the shift to audience-first planning is a key evolution in strategy. This approach, which is rooted in understanding and addressing audience needs, goes beyond traditional campaign planning. The challenge lies in balancing the emotional and product-centered needs, ensuring that personalized, audience-centric strategies coexist harmoniously. The exploration of these new frontiers aligns nicely with our commitment to continuous innovation and adaptation to evolving market dynamics. 


In the evolving landscape of marketing in a data-driven era, Caroline emphasizes the importance of aligning investments with business goals and fostering cross-functional collaboration fueled by data insights. While different industries have nuanced approaches to brand and demand marketing, she emphasizes the need for a strategic balance between short-term actions and long-term brand building. As we hear from Caroline and other marketing leaders, these continue to be reoccurring themes of driving marketing effectiveness in today’s ecosystem. 

Talk to our team to learn more about building relevant brands and driving demand that leads to uncommon growth. 


Brand and Demand: Driving Business Results in the Golden Age of Marketing Effectiveness

Kate Price, Partner at Prophet speaks with Colin Westcott-Pitt, Global Chief Brand Officer at Glanbia Performance Nutrition on how to link marketing initiatives to broader organizational goals.  

Colin Westcott-Pitt is the Global Chief Brand Officer at Glanbia Performance Nutrition where he is responsible for the development and oversight of their brand portfolio. 

Kate Price: Given the disruption of the last few years, marketers are being asked to take on greater accountability and demonstrate the impact and ROI of their marketing investment while creating tighter alignment with overall business objectives. How have you shifted your strategy in response to these challenges? 

Colin Westcott-Pitt: Certainly, the disruption in recent years has been a significant factor in reshaping our marketing priorities. Although, I’ve never viewed business outcomes in conflict with marketing outcomes. In fact, we’ve always operated with the mindset that one leads to another. At a brand’s core, it comes down to revenue and margin objectives. While there might be instances where marketers are overly focused on awareness or perception, in the current landscape it’s essential to strike a balance and recognize that marketing plays a crucial role in driving revenue and overall business success. 

To address the disruption, we’ve adopted a balanced scorecard approach to measure impact and ROI. This involves incorporating both short-term and medium to long-term measures. Recognizing the importance of a balanced strategy, we understand that there is no long-term without the short-term.  

We’ve taken a hard look at the role of data and how to apply it effectively has become essential for identifying growth opportunities, ensuring a balance between existing and new consumers, and ultimately driving strategic decision-making. The challenge lies in ensuring that the organization, at all levels, is fluent in interpreting and applying this data effectively. It’s crucial for the insights and analytics group to simplify complex data for broader understanding. 

KP: How have conversations with your C-suite evolved in light of recent disruptions and how has that impacted the role of brand at your organization? 

CWP: Our conversations have changed significantly. Our leadership team is increasingly engaged and curious about the changing landscape. They increasingly understand the shifting dynamics and ask more of marketing. They often begin with business objectives, emphasizing the importance of linking marketing initiatives to broader organizational goals. 

However, while marketing has undoubtedly become more data-driven and shifted towards performance metrics, the role of storytelling cannot be overlooked. We strive to find a unifying principle that everyone can align with, and that principle is often the brand. We reject the notion of silos where marketing is solely responsible for the brand. Instead, we emphasize that everyone plays a crucial role in shaping the brand experience. This approach helps break down barriers and encourages collaboration. We recognize the importance of each function, whether it’s marketing, manufacturing, or sales, in contributing to the overall success of the brand. Small initiatives, like rewarding employees with branded merchandise, can foster a sense of unity and shared purpose. 

Challenges arise when the brand is not perceived as fundamental. In functions such as finance or manufacturing, for example, it is a key task of marketing to help these teams understand the role of brand across these various departments. To do this, it requires a meaningful effort to communicate that everyone contributes to the success of the brand and, by extension, the business. It’s about instilling a sense of appreciation for the unique role each function plays in achieving overall success. We come back to the phrase “everyone has a unique contribution to success” which reinforces the idea that each person, regardless of their role or function, is integral to the overall success of the brand and the business. It doesn’t always have to be a big initiative. We hit a major milestone in our business this year and handed out t-shirts to all of our teams, which was a relatively small thing, but from an internal employee engagement, it made everybody feel like part of the story. The small things can sometimes go a long way. 

KP: How do you navigate the tensions between brand and demand, especially in the context of demand marketing and short-term performance? 

CWP: I think the key is to avoid viewing brand and demand as an either-or situation but rather embrace the idea of “both-ism,”. Balancing brand and demand is crucial, it really requires a disciplined brand planning process. Our process involves a systematic approach that aligns brand strategy with demand opportunities, setting clear objectives that include pricing strategies, promotions, and channel roles.   

To deliver against this “both-ism” approach, balancing the long and short term, the key is starting with a comprehensive situation assessment and aligning brand strategy with demand opportunities. From there, the brand planning process sets clear objectives, including pricing strategies, promotions, and channel roles. It’s crucial to recognize consumer moments (e.g., New Year’s Resolutions) that matter and retailer moments that matter (e.g., Amazon Prime Day). Success really requires a systematic and collaborative planning approach that considers each function’s unique role at different moments in time.  

We are also relentless in our measurement. Goals are tracked through a strategic performance pyramid that encompasses business objectives like household penetration, market share, and consumption. The pyramid narrows down to more specific metrics like website visits, search levels, and media reach. This provides a clear structure for tracking leading and lagging indicators at both strategic and tactical levels, ensuring the brand’s performance is measured comprehensively and preventing over-reliance on a few seductive metrics. 

KP: In our report, “Brand and Demand: A Love Story” we outline for common principles of brand and demand: anchoring marketing investment in business objectives, experimentation, building a modern marketing organization and putting the customer at the center. Do you agree with these and how do you apply these to your organization? 

CWP: Absolutely, I think these all apply. I’d say recently we’ve especially shifted towards more enthusiasm and passion for experimentation, fostering an environment without fear of failure. As we put a greater emphasis on experimentation, we’ve been able to encourage a culture of trying new things quickly, building curiosity and being data-driven. Our approach to agile learning is facilitated by having specialists delve into emerging areas, utilizing social listening and even experimenting with artificial intelligence. 

I also think we are living in the golden age of effectiveness. Building a modern marketing organization involves understanding contemporary principles and building off models like Ehrenberg Bass. Distinctive assets, a key aspect of discussions, have become more formalized and structured. Our conversations around consumer-centricity have evolved, emphasizing real-time insights and quick feedback mechanisms. We put a greater emphasis on tapping into consumer behavior through super consumer groups and communities, ensuring a continuous effort to stay agile and adapt to changing consumer dynamics. We have a small group of consumers that we tap into on a regular basis for quick feedback. Everything is changing really fast, so having the ability to tap into real-time insights allows us to stay on top of new consumer trends.  

KP: Last but not least, what keeps you excited about marketing?   

CWP: There are a couple of things that I’m particularly excited about. The first is this shift towards being measured against business outcomes. If this is the golden age of marketing effectiveness, and when we’re doing a good job, then our business results should reflect that. Witnessing the tangible results of effective marketing is exhilarating. On the consumer side, the joy lies in working with brands that can make a positive impact on people’s lives. Whether it’s contributing to a healthy lifestyle, performance improvement, or weight management, seeing the positive change in consumers’ lives is truly fulfilling. The happiness and satisfaction of consumers after using the product, like completing a marathon with a smile, adds to the overall excitement. 


Taking a disciplined approach to brand and demand – and building processes to address both functions is crucial for delivering marketing effectiveness. As Colin discussed, more and more, executive teams and boards are asking marketing leaders to prove their ability to influence revenue generation. And to do this, marketers need an integrated strategy to both brand and demand marketing. Talk to our team to learn more about building relevant brands and driving demand that leads to uncommon growth. 


The Yin and Yang of Marketing: Navigating Brand and Demand in Asia 

How can brands harmonize brand marketing and demand generation for sustainable growth? 

In the bustling markets of Asia, where tradition dances with innovation, the battle between brand marketing and demand generation rages on. As companies vie for attention and market share, they grapple with a fundamental question: Which path leads to sustainable growth?  

Brand Marketing: The Art of Storytelling

Brand marketing is the soul of a company – the narrative that weaves through its DNA. It’s the symphony of colors, fonts, and emotions that evoke recognition and loyalty.  

In Asia, brand marketing transcends mere aesthetics; it encapsulates cultural intricacies. It is about preserving heritage while embracing the future. It is the delicate brushstroke that paints cultural nuances, the scent of incense in a bustling marketplace, and the whispered promise of authenticity. Imagine your brand as a tea ceremony – an intricate choreography of leaves, water, and time. Each cup tells a story, and every sip carries centuries of tradition. Moreover, Asia’s consumers crave authenticity. They seek brands that honor their roots while embracing modernity. Your brand is not just a design; but a bridge between generations.  

Take MUJI for example, the iconic home goods retailer, whose “no-brand” philosophy echoes Japan’s minimalist aesthetic and lifestyle. Their products design and eco-friendly practices embody simplicity, functionality, and sustainability. Similarly, up and coming fragrance brand To Summer artfully marries traditional Chinese scents with contemporary sensibilities, symbolizing a bridge between legacy and innovation. At the core of its product designs, To Summer is committed to restoring Eastern botanical scents, while incorporating modern elements in its packaging and retail experiences. 

Demand Generation: The Science of Conversion

Demand generation, on the other hand, is the alchemist’s potion – data-driven marketing that turns curiosity into action. It’s the digital bazaar where clicks become conversions.  

In Asia, it is the neon glow of a night market, the haggling over prices, and the thrill of discovery. Picture your demand generation as a street food stall with the inviting sizzle of skewers and aroma of spices. For Asian consumers, demand generation is synonymous with urgency, akin to a street vendor’s cry of “Limited stock, last chance!”  

Luckin Coffee’s rise in China exemplifies this urgency, capturing consumers’ attention through exciting product launches and brand partnership campaigns. This allowed them to seize the China market with break-neck speed, swiftly surpassing industry giant Starbucks last June. In 2023, Luckin Coffee launched 102 new products, including one Baijiu-infused coffee in collaboration with China’s esteemed liquor brand Maotai. 

The Dance of Growth

Harmonize the Yin and Yang

Successful growth in Asia requires a harmonious blend of brand marketing and demand generation. They are not rivals but rather synergistic dance partners, with brand storytelling setting the stage while demand generation fills the seats. The key lies in regularly fine-tuning your brand-to-demand ratios based on the goals of your brand, the product/campaign and audience response. Brand and demand teams also need to commit to open communication and engagement to achieve an integrated decision-making process.  

In the past two years, Prophet has interviewed brand and demand marketing leaders across the world to understand how these functions can be brought together to drive greater impact. Our research found that the majority (60%) of marketers have a ‘balanced approach’ to Brand and Demand. It’s the orchestration of both channels that often defines their effectiveness. (Download our global report here.) 

A great example of how balancing brand and demand can drive uncommon growth is Lululemon. Consumers in Asia are increasingly health-conscious, yearning for meaningful experiences with physical and mental wellbeing. Capturing these unmet needs, Lululemon markets a healthy lifestyle by placing a great emphasis on building confidence and empowering people through innovative products and positive experiences. By focusing on its core values, Lululemon creates a brand that resonates with its audience. On the other hand, Lululemon focuses on creating a deep connection with its customers through community building on top of brick-and-mortar and e-commerce expansion in Asia. This creates a sense of scarcity while urging customers to join its events. It also allows Lululemon to listen more closely to what the local customers need (e.g. launching Asia Fit line). This strategy helps Lululemon to continuously drive demand, loyalty and advocacy. 

Localizing the Choreography

Asia isn’t a monolith; it’s a mosaic. Brands must adapt their moves to each cultural tile. While it is important to adhere to consistent brand essence and offerings across all global markets, local cultural nuances must be considered when developing a go-to-market strategy for each Asian region. From Japan’s deep bows to India’s respectful nods, cultural sensitivity is paramount in crafting a bespoke go-to-market strategy tailored to each locale. Localization isn’t a checkbox; it’s a pas de deux with the fast-evolving tradition, subcultures and behaviors of the diverse region.  

For example, UGG sought to enhance its relevance and engage Gen-Z consumers globally in a compelling and authentic manner. Partnering with Prophet, UGG embarked on a comprehensive segmentation research, delving into multiple APAC countries to craft tailored consumer journey maps that accounted for regional nuances and cultural intricacies. 

Similarly, Prophet’s collaboration with The North Face yielded a unique positioning and localized customer experience for its loyalty program in Greater China. The brand hoped to expand on the types of benefits provided by the program beyond monetary rewards, ensuring representation of the organization’s brand DNA while elevating consumer perceptions, building greater engagement and further differentiating itself from competitors.  

Orchestrating Moments

In Asia, cultural festivities serve as pivotal crescendos for brand narratives. From Chinese New Year’s jubilant fireworks to Diwali’s vibrant rangolis, brands must choreograph their presence amidst these cultural symphonies.  

Singtel, a Singaporean telecommunications conglomerate, has made a tradition of releasing heartwarming short films for Chinese New Year. These films celebrate the power of technology in connecting families and friends. For instance, their 2023 film, “Don’t Worry, Be Hoppy!” showcases the role the telco plays in bringing families and friends together. Continuing the tradition, Singtel launched a three-minute film titled “A Date With Spring” in 2024 which is a nod to the power of technology to inspire and empower all generations. Singtel’s previous Chinese New Year’s series since 2020 collectively garnered over 50 million views to date as their commitment to storytelling resonated strongly with viewers. Furthermore, Singtel recognizes National Day, one of Singapore’s most significant holidays, by creating annual tributes. Last year in 2023, Singtel released a powerful documentary “From Mudflats to Smart Nation”. This 23-minute film explores Singapore’s remarkable journey of innovation and pivotal role of technology in shaping the country into a smart nation. 


Amidst the flickering neon signs and fragrant incense of Asian markets, growth is a harmonious interplay between brand magic and demand science. Marketers are urged to embrace this fusion, letting Asia’s vibrant rhythm propel you towards prosperity. 


Navigating the New Advertising Frontier: The Buyer’s Market

In this dynamic landscape, a compelling value proposition, measurable impact, experimentation with AI and multi-dimensional returns is essential to stand out.

The advertising industry is experiencing a seismic shift. Earlier this year, during the Upfronts and Newfronts – annual showcases where media companies and digital platforms unveil their upcoming content and advertising opportunities to potential buyers – it was made abundantly clear: we’re living in a buyer’s market, not a seller’s world. In a survey of over 300 U.S. marketers and agency executives, only 49%  said they’d be making Upfront deals – down from 56% a year ago, indicating softer ad spending. On top of that,  spending is expected to rise only slightly, remaining nearly flat moving into the 2024 season. Advertisers are faced with more choices, while budgets are getting tighter. Traditional boundaries that have defined advertising platforms have dissolved, and, as such, opportunities have expanded.

In this era where everyone is grappling for offsite ad spend to support their bottom line and diversify revenue streams—from platforms like Uber, which offers advertising surfaces on its cars and in its app, to retailers like Walmart, which is pushing into in-store advertising, convenience stores like Walgreens, which have turned freezer doors into paid advertising spots and of course, the streamers who all announced their own version of ad-supported tiers—securing your fair share of the advertising pie is imperative. This becomes particularly true as budgets undergo meticulous scrutiny and advertisers are looking to do more with less. In this new, buyer’s world of constrained budgets and limitless options, a sharp value proposition for “why you” over the multitude of alternatives is a necessity.   

To stand out as an advertising platform in this dynamic landscape, consider these core tenets for a compelling value proposition that can guide how you market to advertisers, while also helping you focus on how to deliver internally. 

Lead With Flexibility to Help Advertisers do More With Less  

In this buyer’s market, advertisers are looking to optimize their spends based on performance, seeking the flexibility to move, adjust, or even cancel portions of their budgets as they attempt to do more with fewer resources. They’re looking for partners who can guide them in maximizing investments across all pieces of their interconnected channels. Beyond scaling budgets up or down, they want to be able to move dollars around to effectively allocate over a wider slate of inventory. For example, in NBCUniversal’s pitch, they highlighted that advertisers can easily shift funds between language markets (i.e., English to Spanish) or from sports to entertainment based on real-time performance.  

Measure to Win and Connect to Business Impact 

Being a flexible partner also means offering flexible measurement options – a critical capability in today’s ad landscape. Advertisers don’t want to scatter their budgets across various platforms and hope for a favorable outcome. They’re increasingly seeking partners who can demonstrate how investments in their channels drive tangible business outcomes, moving beyond traditional forms of currency – the measurement system used to evaluate the performance of a campaign. In particular, they’re looking for partners with a handle on KPIs that advertisers haven’t traditionally been able to measure, like advanced audience targeting, engagement and attention. At this year’s Newfronts, Disney announced its measurement effort with outcomes-based measurement provider Innovid, tying ad exposures in Disney video to specific outcomes such as web visits or app downloads. This approach transforms a platform into an “always-on,” adaptable partner rather than a one-off arrangement.   

Embrace Experimentation in a World of Accelerated AI  

While proven strategies remain important, embracing experimentation, particularly in the realm of accelerated AI, is equally important. Digital-first platforms have provided inspiration for innovative tactics to boost value for advertisers. At the 2023 Newfronts, Roku debuted a new “Contextual AI” tool that scans the Roku Channel content library for “iconic plot moments,” matching a brand’s message to relevant parts of shows and movies and placing their ads in real-time. Meanwhile, Meta announced a generative AI “Sandbox” for advertisers, helping smaller businesses create alternative copies and backgrounds while keeping the core message of their ads similar. Most recently, YouTube announced new AI-powered solutions for demand gen, allowing for an advertiser’s best-performing video and image assets to be integrated across touchpoints with the highest traffic and optimizing conversions.  

Offer Multi-Dimensional Value and Return 

In today’s growing retail media landscape, there is no shortage of advertising options. Yet, advertisers and agencies are looking for more with fewer resources. More reach, more return, more measurement – less juggling, less apples-to-oranges conversions, less headaches. With many of the media giants having the ability to sell at a broader portfolio level and offering consolidated buys, across platforms, formats and audiences, individual platforms and channels will be challenged to offer differentiated value based on the status quo. There will need to be a compelling reason, the ability to reach niche audiences, higher ad performance – anything to make the ad buy multi-dimensional in value, return, and overall fit in an ongoing media model mix. 


As we navigate this evolving landscape, the key to success lies in crafting a compelling value proposition that aligns with the needs – and excitement—of advertisers in this buyer-centric world. Looking toward the next Upfronts and Newfronts season, striking a balance between adaptability, measurability, and experimentation will be integral to the narratives of those who end up on top.    


Brand and Demand: Sheila Shekar Pollak on the Role of Creativity and Innovation in Marketing Today

The Chief Brand Experience Officer at Orvis shares insights about the challenges facing modern marketers including the importance of team dynamics, creative innovation and cross-functional collaboration. 

Sheila Shekar Pollak is the Chief Brand Experience Officer at Orvis, a leading outdoor retailer.  

Shekar Pollak brings over 20 years of experience growing and strengthening global, mission-driven brands. Previously, Pollak was with the Gap Inc. family of brands, including the CMO at Athleta where she drove double-digit revenue and earnings growth and launched the iconic ‘Power of She’ brand platform. 

Scott: What are the primary concerns keeping you up at night as a leading marketer? 

Sheila: Team burnout is my foremost concern. The relentless challenges our team faces, combined with the uncertain future, have led to exhaustion and stress. I worry about retaining our talented staff and keeping them motivated amidst these difficulties. We oversee all the marketing, creative and sales channels for our wholesale, retail, e-commerce and adventure business. It’s a lot and we have to find ways to celebrate small wins in this challenging environment. I try to be very intentional and focused on what I’m asking of my team. I am constantly thinking about how to motivate and keep people fired up. How do we stay focused and what can we let go of? For the past few years, it sometimes feels like we’re sprinting an Ironman, and it can be emotionally taxing. So, I’m really focused on the health and well-being of my team.  

Separately, I think a lot about connecting with customers in a meaningful way amid economic uncertainties. For us, a specific challenge is the saturation of products in the market and how to tell a creative and compelling story that resonates with our customers.   

Scott: How have your marketing priorities shifted in response to the current economic environment? 

Sheila: Our focus has narrowed significantly. Coming out of Covid, we had the best years in our 167-year history. The outdoor boom led to unprecedented growth, but as we shifted back to a more typical business cycle, we had to rethink new ways to grow our business – both with current and new customers. We are relentlessly focused on emphasizing product excellence and refining our offerings to stand out in a competitive market.  

Not only do we need to create great products, but we need to tell great stories. To do this, we’re really leaning into creativity and innovation. We’re putting a renewed focus on telling stories that speak to experiences that not only align with our purpose and values but also the nuts and bolts of the product. Our goal is to simplify everything down to making and selling truly great products. 

We’ve always been customer-obsessed, and that continues to be a focal point for us. We’re very dialed into our customers and are constantly monitoring our retention and acquisition opportunities. We have strong customer loyalty but continue to look for new ways to drive customer acquisition. The top of the funnel hasn’t always been a core area of focus for us, and we’re reevaluating our strategy to find new ways to drive acquisition. I do think the current market conditions play a significant role as it’s harder to convince people to try new brands and to spend right now.   

Scott: That’s an interesting point about not focusing as much on the top of the funnel, can you elaborate on why it wasn’t a focus in the past and how you’re shifting your strategy to emphasize the top of the funnel more?  

Sheila: As I mentioned earlier, we saw incredible growth in 2020-2021, and I’d argue that was likely due in part to the natural tailwinds of the macro environment. To continue to drive growth, we’re taking a deep look at our business to make sure we have the foundational pieces in place to continue our forward momentum. We’d like to be the masters of our destiny, so to speak, instead of relying on the economic conditions. So that’s part of our focus on putting a renewed focus on product excellence. Marketing is partnering closely with our product team to create high-quality products that the market truly desires. We recently released a new dog bed that hit a nerve with customers, and we leaned into our storytelling and influencers to tell a story that people connected with. We’re looking for more moments like that to break through by using powerful creativity and storytelling.   

Scott: Can you elaborate on your approach to balancing brand and demand in your marketing strategies? 

Sheila: We’ve been heavily focused on demand, given the pressure to meet revenue goals. However, we also recognize the importance of brand awareness and storytelling. While demand strategies are necessary, creativity and innovation are crucial. I’m a big believer in the brand. We’ve started working with a PR firm and media influencers to share more stories about the conservation work we’re involved with. So, we’re exploring unconventional methods to capture attention and create genuine connections with our audience. It’s about finding the balance between driving sales and building a lasting brand image. Performance marketing alone can’t drive value. While demand will likely still play an outsized role in the near future, to drive real value, brand is a critical component of our marketing investment.  

Scott: What role does AI play in your marketing efforts, and how do you envision its future in your strategies? 

Sheila: We’re in the exploration phase with AI. While it offers real potential in customer targeting and optimizing experiences, I don’t think it’s a replacement for creativity and the human touch. Our brand is about creating experiences that connect people with nature and create lasting and memorable life experiences. I see a real opportunity with AI to enhance our strategies, especially in customer optimization and experience enhancement. However, I’m cautious about losing the genuine essence of our brand. That being said, we do recognize as a leadership team that AI is something we need to wrap our arms around pretty quickly. 

Scott: And finally, how do you manage to break down internal silos within the organization to foster better collaboration across functions? 

Sheila: It starts at the top. Getting leadership on board with the idea of cross-functional collaboration is crucial. Establishing a “first team” mentality, where everyone collaborates for collective success, has been transformative. Building strong relationships between functional leaders, based on transparency, empathy, and mutual benefit, has been instrumental in breaking down silos and achieving better outcomes. I’m lucky because our president is fully bought into this idea. And, with that support, I have been able to build an incredible relationship with our head of product. We’re constantly checking in with each other. It’s the best partnership I’ve ever had – and by adopting the “first team” approach, we’ve been able to accomplish much more, quickly, and with better outcomes. It’s an absolute game-changer when done right.  


Sheila’s insights offer a valuable perspective on the challenges faced by modern marketers and the strategies needed to navigate the evolving landscape. By emphasizing the importance of team dynamics, creative innovation, and collaboration, Sheila provides a roadmap for marketers aiming to thrive in a rapidly changing world.  

Talk to our team today to learn more about building relevant brands that drive uncommon growth. 


Brand and Demand: Diego Norris on the State of CPG Marketing

Mat Zucker, Senior Partner at Prophet, speaks with Diego Norris, CMO at Gimme Seaweed, on the evolution of CPG marketing and the impact of AI on marketers.  

Diego Norris is the Chief Marketing Officer at Gimme Seaweed, leading the overall marketing strategy for the number one-selling organic seaweed-based snack.

Norris has over 20 years of experience in various marketing and innovation roles for leading CPG companies, including General Mills, Nestle Nutrition, Red Bull, Pinkberry and Campbell Soup. He has also spent several years in consulting, first at Deloitte, where he started his career, and later at Prophet, where he helped technology and healthcare companies build relentlessly relevant brand strategies. 

Mat Zucker: Given the disruption of the last few years, marketers are often asked to take on greater accountability to demonstrate immediate impact and ROI of marketing investment while creating tighter alignment with the business outcomes. Has that been your experience? If so, how have you shifted your strategy to show impact? 

Diego Norris: The push for Marketing to demonstrate immediate impact has increased significantly in recent years. However, this shift isn’t merely a response to increased demands from leadership, board members or shareholders. Developing high-performance programs that are tightly aligned with business objectives is also necessary. 

In this context, the role of marketing data and analytics has become essential. It helps us identify the most valuable programs, assess the impact of A/B tests, and optimize our way to high performance. 

At Gimme Seaweed, we’ve embraced this change with open arms. About a year and a half ago, we started capturing and manually aggregating marketing metrics by business objectives. Earlier this year, we were able to automate this process, which allowed us to get real-time marketing performance data. We are currently integrating AI to enable campaign management automation, the pièce de resistance in our plan for seaweed world domination. 

MZ: How have conversations with your C-suite and board changed as you take on new accountability in driving and proving business value? 

DN: The conversation with the C-suite and board has definitely changed in response to these new demands. A significant portion of our focus now goes into creating a shared understanding of what drives marketing performance in 2023 compared to years past. This helps lay the foundation for focusing on the right business objectives and KPIs. 

Unfortunately, there’s a lot of noise surrounding Marketing today, including no longer effective legacy practices that continue to have broad adoption, well-intentioned but often misguided business partners, false prophets, lack of alignment on KPIs, and inconsistent metric definitions across channels, to name a few. This noise can sometimes make building a shared understanding between key stakeholders difficult. 

In the midst of all this chaos, having solid data at our fingertips has proven to be extremely helpful. It’s like having a reliable compass that helps us navigate through the fog, bringing a dose of clarity and objectivity to discussions.  

MZ: Within your organization, how do you partner with other internal business units and teams to unlock new opportunities for driving growth? Has this evolved in recent years? 

DN: I am definitely seeing increasing levels of cross-pollination between functions, especially between marketing and sales. Several developments in the CPG industry in recent years are fueling this trend and helping blur the lines between these two functions. Most notably, the push for marketing to demonstrate its impact on sales, the emergence of retail media as a primary marketing channel, and retailers’ increasing focus on eCommerce, which relies heavily on digital marketing support. 

For these reasons, many CPG companies, including Gimme Seaweed, now house eCommerce in marketing. This shift has facilitated the dismantling of silos, enabling a more fluid allocation of marketing funds to where performance is strongest. Moreover, it has fostered a tighter knit between marketing and sales, creating a symbiotic relationship geared toward unlocking new avenues for growth. 

MZ: Last year, we published a report, “Brand and Demand Marketing: A Love Story” which speaks to the tensions between brand and demand marketing and why working in silos harms performance. We believe both are critical functions that need to work together to enable success. How do you balance brand and demand within your marketing organization? 

DN: To me, the ongoing debate between brand and performance marketing seems a bit silly, almost like a misunderstanding of the fundamental aspects of a well-rounded marketing plan. It’s essential to recognize that these aren’t optional components you can choose from but integral elements of a successful marketing ecosystem. 

To put it in simpler terms, let’s liken this scenario to farming. Think of brand marketing as the act of planting seeds, nurturing the ground for the next season’s crop, and setting the stage for future bounty, in other words, future demand generation. On the flip side, performance marketing is akin to harvesting the crops we painstakingly nurtured in the previous season, reaping the rewards of our efforts by capturing conversion-ready demand. 

However, the catch here, and what most people overlook, is that in this metaphorical world, farms don’t have fences guarding them. This lack of barriers means anyone, including our competitors, can swoop in and harvest the crops we’ve nurtured with so much care. It’s a wild, open field out there, and a robust performance marketing strategy acts as our safeguard, ensuring we reap the benefits of our hard work without leaving room for competitors to cash in on our efforts. 

But it’s a delicate balance. Performance marketing cannot be ramped up beyond the existing level of demand without facing diminishing returns. It’s about finding the sweet spot where we’re not leaving money on the table, yet not overspending to the point of undermining our performance. 

I must admit, I am very appreciative when competitors neglect performance marketing. It essentially gives us the green light to bring our combine into their fields to harvest their crops. I like harvesting. 

MZ: In the report, we found there are four common principles that most effective markers follow for success: 

  • Anchoring Marketing Investment in Business Objectives
  • Experimenting to Win 
  • Building a Modern Marketing Organization 
  • Putting the Customer at the Center 

Do you agree with these principles? Are there any examples you can share where you’ve been able to implement them? 

DN: We practically live by those principles at Gimme Seaweed! Each of our marketing programs nests under one of three business objectives. And it’s the business objective that defines the KPIs that will be used to measure performance, not the program. Aligning marketing programs and metrics to business objectives keeps the focus where it should be, and this, in turn, accelerates growth. 

An additional element that has proven incredibly helpful has been allowing working dollars of programs that nest under the same objective to flow freely where KPI performance is strongest. This makes these programs compete for funding and creates the conditions needed for continuous improvement. It’s a bit of a Darwinian approach that fosters the survival of the fittest strategies and maximizes value creation. 

MZ: What are some top challenges you anticipate in the next 6-18 months? What are you doing to help your organization plan and overcome those challenges? 

DN: Let’s tackle the giant, looming question that’s on everyone’s mind: the rise of AI and its profound impact on the marketing world. At the risk of oversimplification, CPG marketers have two big jobs to do. First, there’s the creative side of things, where we dive deep into brand strategy, target consumer selection, brand positioning, visual identity and the overall tone of our communications. Then, there’s the logistical side, where we focus on efficiently delivering these crafted messages to our target audience, navigating the intricate maze of marketing mix, platform selection, campaign management, data analytics, and marketing spend allocation. 

Even though we’re still in the early stages of AI’s integration into marketing, it’s becoming increasingly clear that the logistical side of marketing is about to see a seismic shift. The intricacies of managing campaigns, analyzing data, and optimizing performance are about to skyrocket in complexity. Soon, it may become nearly impossible for marketers to handle these tasks without the aid of AI. The landscape is evolving so that those who embrace AI and its capabilities will have a significant edge over those who don’t. The divide is going to be stark, almost binary in nature. 

At Gimme Seaweed, we’re not just watching from the sidelines but actively gearing up to stay ahead in this race. I envision three pivotal elements that will anchor our marketing endeavors in the coming months: access to real-time marketing performance data, harnessing the power of AI for data processing and analytics with well-defined decision parameters and leveraging AI for seamless campaign automation. With these in place, we aim to be agile, identifying and capitalizing on real-time performance opportunities. This approach will allow our marketing investments to flow toward areas of peak performance within each of our meta-objectives. 

The current wave of innovation and the potential it holds is genuinely exhilarating. Every day feels like a new learning opportunity. I’m wholeheartedly diving in, eager to absorb as much as possible to help steer Gimme Seaweed towards the best possible future. 

About Mat Zucker

Mat is a senior partner and co-lead of Prophet’s Marketing and Sales practice. He helps clients transform digitally, finding new areas of growth in marketing, content and communications. Previously, Mat was the Global Executive Creative Director at Razorfish, served as Chief Creative Officer at OgilvyOne New York and held leadership roles at R/GA and In addition to helping clients creatively connect and engage with their customers, he hosts two podcasts, Cidiot and Rising. 

Are you interested in talking with Mat? You can contact him, here. 


In our new series, Brand and Demand: The Interviews, Prophet experts sit down with CMOs and marketing leaders who are unlocking demand, driving uncommon growth and building relentlessly relevant brands to get their takes on the top trends, challenges and opportunities they face in today’s disruptive world.


Brand and Demand: Kelly Jo Golson on Building a Marketing Organization that Wins Consumer Trust

Scott Davis, Chief Growth Officer at Prophet speaks with Kelly Jo Golson, Chief Brand, Communications and Consumer Experience Officer at Advocate Health about how marketing can build consumer trust to support an organization’s growth strategy.

Kelly Jo Golson is the Chief Brand, Communications and Consumer Experience Officer at Advocate Health where she oversees marketing and consumer experience for a leading healthcare system.

Golson brings nearly 30 years of industry experience spanning consumerism, brand, marketing, digital strategy, public affairs and internal communications. A leader with Advocate since 2007, she previously held roles with Methodist Healthcare System, St. Luke’s Episcopal Healthcare and Memorial Hermann Healthcare.

Scott Davis: With all the shifts that have gone on through COVID and now an economic downturn, what matters the most to you right now as a chief marketing officer leading one of the biggest U.S. health systems?

Kelly Jo Golson: You know, there’s a long list of things that matter, right? But one of the things that keeps coming back to me is credibility. Patients and consumers are bombarded with noise and misinformation. Being the voice of trust and reliability, and the place consumers and patients turn to for accurate information and a trustworthy experience is our top priority.

SD: Do you think healthcare has been fairly or unfairly punished over the last three to five years in terms of breaking consumer trust, or is it just the general environment of everything being highly scrutinized?

KJ: Prior to COVID, it was challenging. Patients often came to appointments with self-diagnoses and information they found online. However, I believe the last three years with COVID have helped healthcare systems regain trust. Our experts provided accurate, impartial information at an uncertain time, repositioning the patient and physician relationship and reestablishing doctors as reliable sources amid the chaos of constantly changing information. That trust and the continuous, end-to-end relationship with patients have become crucial factors in our industry and are something we will continue to lean into to ensure we stay relevant with our patients.

SD: It goes way beyond the physician-patient relationship; it’s the entire 360-degree experience. What challenges do you see in delivering this holistic experience, and how are you addressing them? From a marketing perspective, how are you thinking about these challenges and where do you see opportunity?

KJ: Absolutely. Building strong relationships with patients on both the front end and back end of care is challenging but essential. We’ve made strides, especially with high-acuity patients. However, there’s still a long way to go in terms of price transparency, accessibility, personalized self-service, and meeting consumer expectations.

For me, shifting consumer expectations has redefined my role. I’ve gone from being a Chief Marketing Officer to a Chief Brand Officer and, now more importantly, a Chief Consumer Experience Officer. Understanding and meeting consumer needs and expectations have become paramount. Research shows that an exceptional experience has a higher impact on loyalty and action than the care itself. For example, you may have a world-class cardiovascular program, but as soon as someone realizes they’re at risk for heart disease, they are thinking about how easy it is to get in to see a cardiologist. What’s the wait time? How easy is it for them to receive the next level of care and receive relevant communications? These experiences have become increasingly important as people consider their care options. So, our focus has shifted toward ensuring a seamless experience from awareness to care delivery.

SD: You’ve made a significant shift from patient to consumer. Why was it essential to broaden the frame of reference of who’s walking in those doors or on that telehealth call every day?

KJ: Patient experience is still paramount, but we’ve realized that our patients’ changing expectations, driven by their experiences in other industries, require us to become consumer-first. For years, healthcare has been able to put this on the back burner, but with new entrants entering the space, it’s a critical moment for healthcare systems to rethink how we build loyalty. It’s about creating a meaningful relationship with consumers even before they need care, emphasizing wellness over sickness care. Their expectations have evolved, and we need to adapt accordingly.

SD: I know you’ve worked side-by-side with your CEO; how has the evolution of marketing impacted the growth strategy? How do marketing and long-term strategy work together?

KJ: Our growth strategy is deeply intertwined with everything we do in marketing. I’d say we take a three-pronged approach. We recognize that losing even one patient due to poor experience requires acquiring three new ones to compensate for the lost revenue. Additionally, as we transition into accountable care organizations (ACOs), the continuity of care becomes vital. We aim to keep patients within our system for the entire care journey. Lastly, with cost pressures coming into play across the industry, finding efficiencies that allow us to reinvest in places that our patients are asking for is critical. Marketing plays a pivotal role in facilitating this continuity and efficiency.

SD: In today’s environment, we’re seeing budgets being scrutinized and the need to prove ROI for marketing investments. This leads to a conversation we’ve been having with many CMOs about brand and demand marketing. How do you navigate this constant tension between building reputation and driving demand, especially in times of economic change?

KJ: It’s essential to be agile and adapt to the context. We don’t go all-in on either brand or demand; we continually evaluate the situation. We must understand the economic climate, competitive landscape, and our capacity to deliver on our promises. There is no quicker way to damage your brand if you can’t deliver on your promises. Agility is key to striking the right balance and ensuring we’re meeting patient expectations and delivering value. Something that has enabled this agility is having the right mix of talent on our internal teams to support these moves. Within the digital ecosystem, we must be ready and willing to turn the dial up or down depending on our ability to deliver while also meeting the needs of the business.

SD: Building a modern marketing organization is a challenge for many. How have you approached this, especially in the context of rapidly evolving technologies and consumer expectations?

KJ: We’ve been intentional about modernizing our marketing organization. This includes differentiating and creating a standalone consumer insights department, separating brand and marketing, bringing media buying in-house, and developing in-house creative services. We continuously evaluate our structure and its effectiveness in facilitating collaboration and delivering value to consumers.

SD: Lastly, how are you approaching the use of AI in healthcare marketing? What opportunities and challenges do you foresee in integrating AI into your strategies?

KJ: AI holds immense potential in healthcare marketing, particularly in personalizing content, optimizing search, and enhancing the consumer experience. However, we’re cautious about maintaining trust and credibility. We want to ensure that AI augments our efforts without compromising patient trust. Experimentation and learning from industry best practices will guide our AI integration journey.

About Scott Davis  

Scott is a senior partner and the Chief Growth Officer at Prophet. He brings over 20 years of brand, marketing strategy and new product development experience. Scott speaks at and chairs branding conferences such as The Conference Board and the American Marketing Association and is frequently cited in publications like The Wall Street Journal, BusinessWeek, and Forbes. In addition to helping clients unlock uncommon growth, he is an Adjunct Professor at the Kellogg School of Management at Northwestern University and a guest lecturer at other top graduate schools, including NYU, Harvard, Notre Dame, Medill and Columbia. 

Are you interested in talking with Scott? You can contact him here.


In our new series, Brand and Demand: The Interviews, Prophet experts sit down with CMOs and marketing leaders who are unlocking demand, driving uncommon growth and building relentlessly relevant brands to get their takes on the top trends, challenges and opportunities they face in today’s disruptive world.


AI in Marketing: Four Ways to Maximize Value

The emergence of AI is not the first digital shift marketers have experienced. And it won’t be the last. Here are four ways to drive innovation in marketing with AI.

Generative AI has taken center stage in virtually every business article, LinkedIn post and cocktail party conversation. And for good reason – ChatGPT drove one million users in its first five days, turning the technology into a household name and transforming how businesses think about productivity and efficiency. For marketers getting their heads around it and starting to experiment, the potential can be either daunting or inspiring.  

Marketers have always been at the forefront of technology. AI and machine learning have been critical in shaping programmatic buying, lifecycle marketing and digital experiences. And for many marketers, this isn’t the first shift they’ve experienced within their role. 

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A Framework for Supercharging Your Marketing Efforts With AI  

It’s helpful to think of AI as a tool to help enhance what you do as a marketer, especially when it comes to thinking about customers and their needs. Here are four ways marketers can use AI to show up for their customers in more connected and cohesive ways:  

Unlocking Understanding 

Many AI-driven models excel at analyzing unstructured data, text, images, videos and other content that does not fit neatly into traditional databases. Typically, this type of analysis is time-consuming and expensive, requiring its own algorithms. 

Marketers can use AI to help analyze large volumes of data, recognize complex patterns, explore and visualize data, perform predictive analytics and provide real-time insights to drive more personalized and optimized marketing strategies and tactics.  

Companies like Amazon, Netflix, Meta and Alphabet are far ahead of the curve. But so are non-tech players, such as Johnson & Johnson’s Neutrogena and JP Morgan Chase. All using AI to analyze data and use it in ways that directly benefit customer experience.  

Unlocking Value 

AI automates repetitive and time-consuming processes, reducing the number of daily tasks, and freeing up hours so that marketers can focus on higher-order priorities that require more strategic, human thinking. Smart marketers are learning ways to turn those found hours into new initiatives, liberating marketing teams to find new avenues of growth. 

Adore Me, the e-commerce lingerie company recently acquired by Victoria’s Secret now uses AI to churn out hundreds of product descriptions. While copywriters still need to read, tweak and occasionally edit the blurbs, it estimates it saves up to 40 hours a month per copywriter, with zero impact on sales. Even better? Copywriters hated writing those tedious descriptions. By delegating that work to AI, they can focus on higher-order campaigns that drive additional revenue. 

Unlocking Creativity  

With more marketers being asked to do more with less resources, AI can be an essential tool. It can help reduce the time it takes to generate creative concepts, create visually appealing and engaging content, facilitate brainstorming processes, and draw insights from past campaigns that can help marketers take personalization to the next level for future campaigns.  

Lexus, for instance, used AI to transform its Auto Show experience this year, inviting attendees to enter prompts that quickly personalized their new cars on a 98-inch screen. And political attack ads using AI-created voices of opponents are already reshaping the upcoming election cycle. 

Unlocking Differentiation 

With its speed of processing data, sifting through customer insights and analyzing competitors, AI can suggest gaps in the market to help companies create personalized, innovative and differentiated experiences that cater to specific customer needs. 

For example, Unilever uses AI to explore the human gut, home to trillions of bacteria. Using big-data biology, the company is isolating the microbes with the most calming potential and experimenting with biotech partners to pinpoint food and beverage ingredients that will have the most positive impact on mental well-being. Its Knorr soup division, recently used AI to analyze millions of flavor combinations in days rather than months, using digital modeling to create a zero-salt (but still delicious) soup cube.  

To maximize success with AI it’s important to remember that AI is more useful when it is centered on human needs.  

Creating an AI-Readiness Checklist  

Marketing organizations must also have the necessary data capabilities to implement and operationalize AI effectively. Those include thoughtful attention to:  

Data Foundation: Quality Over Quantity  

Companies must have high-quality, first-party data stored in secure infrastructures with clear, consistent taxonomy that can be processed at a high volume.  

Best Practice: Focusing on securing quality information rather than rushing to get the biggest datasets fast will prevent future inefficiencies and accuracy problems. And despite the focus on large-language models, it’s important to note that many tech companies are experimenting with smaller versions, which may be more accurate and efficient.   

Data Value Exchange: Upping the Ante  

Companies must offer additive products and services for customers in exchange for their data and provide transparency for how data will be used.   

Best Practice: In a world where AI tools are accessible to all, companies can offer trust and respect for privacy as a differentiated yet still personalized experience to customers.   

Data Culture & Fluency: The Heart of AI Transformation   

Companies must pursue broad AI fluency across the whole enterprise as well as invest in specific data and AI expertise to continuously innovate.  

Best Practice: Without the people to understand and strategically use AI at all levels of the organization, companies will not be able to unlock uncommon growth.  

Fully implementing AI will require proper evaluation and tracking against an adoption timeline. As soon as possible, begin incorporating AI into workflows, explore opportunities for sustainable optimization and continue to scale it.   

Coming soon: New AI research from Prophet will help you understand and serve the AI-powered consumer. Subscribe to our mailing list to be among the first to get their hands on these insights!


Modern marketers have used AI and machine learning in their practices for years and are finding new ways to embrace the possibilities of generative AI. Whether unlocking understanding, value, creativity or differentiation, marketers must remember that AI will be most useful when centered on human needs.


Webinar Replay – Jumpstart Your Marketing Planning: Doing More With Less

As marketers look to close the year strong and head into 2024 planning, we’ve identified seven critical steps marketing organizations should take to inform next year’s planning.

55 min


Drawing from insights found in Prophet’s recent report, “Marketers’ 2023 and 2024 Planning Do-More-With-Bootcamp”, hosts Kate Price and Mat Zucker along with panelists Chris Rector, Chief Marketing Officer at GAF Roofing, Lisa Bialecki, Vice President of Marketing & Demand at Rust-Oleum and Leigh Huther, Vice President of Marketing at Trane Technologies share how they effectively balance brand and demand marketing agendas with constrained resources.

Listen to the webinar replay for the seven steps marketing organizations should apply to your 2024 marketing planning and for actionable ideas you can take back to your team.


Brand and Demand: Brad Kreiger On Driving Brand Marketing and AI through a Historic Economic Downturn 

Scott Davis, Chief Growth Officer at Prophet, speaks with Brad Kreiger, CMO at Cushman & Wakefield on AI powered marketing. 

Brad Kreiger is the Chief Marketing and Communications Officer at Cushman & Wakefield and is responsible for the organization’s global marketing, communications and research functions. Within his role, he focuses on building the brand, demand generation, marketing technology and digital platforms, regional and service line marketing and business development activities, and research and thought leadership.  

Before joining Cushman & Wakefield, Kreiger co-founded Hard Hat Hub, a technology startup that created a digital talent marketplace in construction and facilities management. Prior, he spent a decade as SVP of Marketing at JLL, where he oversaw various corporate communications, marketing and business development functions.  

Scott Davis: Given the disruption and uncertainty we have faced over the last few years, how do you approach both executing your marketing strategy and organizing your marketing team?   

Brad Kreiger: COVID started as a big challenge no one knew how to solve. But at Cushman & Wakefield, we had the expertise and a powerful POV within our industry on how companies should operate relative to the pandemic. Some of that came through our experience during the SARS pandemic because we have a significant presence in China. By the time the pandemic had reached the United States, we were three months ahead of many of our competitors, which allowed us to position Cushman & Wakefield as an industry thought leader. That shift in our positioning positively impacted all of our brand metrics, especially PR.   

We have a senior team of economists and market researchers focusing on creating best-in-class thought leadership. I also have a smart, lean and scrappy corporate marketing team that manages PR and content marketing and also sits alongside the team of market researchers and economists.   

And in this uncertain environment, we are constantly evolving our go-to-market playbook. For example, we recently launched a new campaign called “Behind the Numbers,” which features 90-second Tik-Tok style videos from the perspective of a senior economist who just stepped out of a meeting with a client. We see phenomenal reach with these videos, much more than expected for a B2B organization.  

In addition to experimenting with our go-to-market playbook, we’re also doing a lot to mobilize our content by experimenting, taking risks and modernizing our channel mix. We’re also launching crisp positioning and messaging and trying to implement a  marketing strategy that is more B2C in terms of our message delivery, which has worked well and helped us increase our speed-to-market. My team is concentrating on launching quality and relevant content that helps our corporate and investor clients decide their next move.   

SD: It’s incredible how Cushman & Wakefield has taken major disruptions like the pandemic or the return-to-office debate and has risen as an industry thought leader shaping and directing the narrative around these significant events.  

BK: We’re not afraid to stand up and speak the truth as a brand. We saw a great reaction from our clients and the marketplace, so we continued to double down and go harder, which has become our signature go-to-market strategy. We lead with a strong POV and thought leadership. It’s fantastic when that aligns with us driving more revenue, but it can be even better if it doesn’t because it demonstrates the risk we are willing to take as a brand. That type of risk-taking has helped increase our credibility because we are saying things before our competitors and, therefore, have been early on many industry trends.   

SD: How has the relationship between marketing and sales within your organization shifted due to where you are as an organization? Does that relationship feel different than it did pre-pandemic?   

BK: We have a “we’re in it together mentality” because we’ve had some downturns within the market, which has enabled marketing to take the lead on driving demand. The results of marketing’s demand generation wins in the last few years have proven to our salesforce the importance of our relationship and have helped them see that marketing can do things they cannot do on their own. Additionally, our senior management sees the important link between sales and marketing, which is very different from other B2B organizations.  

SD: What is marketing’s role in shaping the overall corporate strategy for your firm, and how has that changed over the years?  

BK: Our organization is in the process of refreshing our strategic goals and business strategy, and marketing has a seat at the table regarding the overall corporate strategy. I also have a position on our firm’s global management team.  

SD: It’s fascinating to see you play a pivotal role in reimaging what Cushman & Wakefield can become and shift the frame of reference for what this business has been for the last 100 years.   

BK: Over the last eight years, the firm has transformed into a multi-billion-dollar global organization. It’s been an incredible transformation. When I think back on the first campaign I launched here, it was the “Welcome to the new Cushman & Wakefield” campaign. Since then, we’ve launched our environmental, social and governance (ESG) and corporate social responsibility (CSR) programs. We’ve expanded into growing sectors like multi-family. We’ve matured our operations and reimagined our global infrastructure. As a member of our senior management team, I always ask myself, “Did the brand keep up with the pace of change?” “Does it reflect who we are and what we want to be in a decade?” We continually ask those questions to ensure our brand strategy meets the demands of our clients and market.  

SD: What is your brand and demand mix today, and what will it look like in the future?    

BK: As a B2B sales organization, and in a very competitive industry, demand and sales enablement will always be our heaviest weight in the mix. Call it 70% of what we do. That might tilt a little heavier to brand during down market conditions as we try to leverage our thought leadership across common client challenges. As the industry continues to evolve and consolidate, I think brand will continue to grow in the mix. The trick is ensuring the brand messages speak to the very disparate corners across the industry with consistency and relevance. 

SD: Given the disruption of the last few years, marketers are often asked to take on greater accountability to demonstrate immediate impact and ROI of marketing investment while creating tighter alignment with the business outcomes. Has that been your experience? If so, how have you shifted your strategy to show impact?  

BK: Currently, my team is working on fully automating our digital funnel to get to the point of measuring the critical metrics within each funnel stage. Our team has people sitting across the marketing funnel and within each stage, we identify the critical metrics to determine what conversion means at that stage in the customer journey.   

SD: Many marketing leaders are experimenting with AI within their organizations. Are you incorporating AI into your marketing practices, and if so, what does that look like?   

BK: We are running a lot of AI pilots and projects. We aim to use AI to either accelerate our marketing efforts or scale them, depending on our needs. We’re also experimenting with creative development, such as copywriting or graphic design. For example, with the video campaign series “Behind the Numbers,” we are using AI software to help accelerate our video editing capabilities. It’s exciting and we have an incredibly nimble team across the organization on AI right now. 

SD:  It’s evident that AI is enabling your team to be more efficient, but have you experienced any challenges when implementing AI to drive efficiency and if so how did you overcome them?  

BK:  I feel lucky that our firm has had an AI-backed transformation team now for several years. That’s helped my leadership overcome some of the early challenges around understanding what automation can do. It’s taken some of the fear out of the process. Now that we’re introducing generative AI into our marketing content processes, the challenges are really about training and scaling the process. Which means having strong change management partners. We measure the success based on typical efficiency metrics around shortening processes, but also on quality. Both are critical. I think AI is a means to an end, but you shouldn’t lose focus on the big-picture success metrics of the marketing program. 

SD: How will AI transform marketing in the next few years?   

BK: Big question. It will likely change the entire way the web works and ‘digital marketing’ around it. It might allow us to leapfrog clunky tech development and focus more on connecting data sets. And it should allow us to be more creative. That might sound counterintuitive, but if you think about the energy it takes to generate one creative idea today, we may be able to come up with 50 concepts in the same amount of time. Add that to reducing all the administrative tasks,  what’s left are creative, passionate marketers who know their customers and can use their experience to evaluate the best ways to get messages to market. It’s going to be exciting. 

SD: What advice do you have for marketing leaders and CMOs navigating the uncertainty of the next few years?  

BK: Leading the marketing function is not for the faint of heart. You have to be ready to react to what’s happening and make decisions fast. The world has gotten very complicated, yet organizations are facing pressure to grow at the same pace as when the world was less volatile. All of this is making it even more complicated than ever to get your message out, which is why great marketing leaders listen more than they talk and are aware of their audience and how they make decisions. If you are an old-school leader who thinks that pretty and shiny ads will beat people down with your message, you will not succeed. In this market, you need to meet people where they are and understand how your product and brand need to evolve.  

About Scott Davis  

Scott is a senior partner and the Chief Growth Officer at Prophet. He brings over 20 years of brand, marketing strategy and new product development experience. Scott speaks at and chairs branding conferences such as The Conference Board and the American Marketing Association and is frequently cited in publications like The Wall Street Journal, BusinessWeek, and Forbes. In addition to helping clients unlock uncommon growth, he is an Adjunct Professor at the Kellogg School of Management at Northwestern University and a guest lecturer at other top graduate schools, including NYU, Harvard, Notre Dame, Medill and Columbia. 

Are you interested in talking with Scott? You can contact him here.


In our new series, Brand and Demand: The Interviews, Prophet experts sit down with CMOs and marketing leaders who are unlocking demand, driving uncommon growth and building relentlessly relevant brands to get their takes on the top trends, challenges and opportunities they face in today’s disruptive world.   


Marketers’ 2023 and 2024 Planning Do-More-With-Less Bootcamp

Budget tightening is this year’s corporate mantra. Here are seven steps marketing leaders can take to drive meaningful growth with fewer resources.

Ask any marketer, and they’ll tell you that 2023 has been a year of budget cuts and canceled launches. According to Gartner’s CMO Spend and Strategy 2023 Survey, 75% of senior marketers reported being asked to do more with less. As budgets decrease, marketing expectations significantly increase, with 86% of surveyed senior marketers agreeing their organization must undergo significant changes in how they work to achieve their goals.   

Right now, that near-universal do more with less directive is an especially bitter pill. Marketers still have whiplash from the last few years, with some businesses seeing massive contraction during the pandemic and others experiencing dizzying growth, resulting in competing interests between brand and demand. Many hoped for at least a glimmer of normalcy.   

Between inflation and rising interest rates, the likelihood of a recession has become a daily odds-making game for economists. The risk is falling. Yet many, including CEOs, investors, legislators and consumers, are already entrenched in a `vibecession.’ They feel things are bad, even if economic indicators don’t support that view. In conjunction with the disruption of the last few years, it has become almost impossible for marketers to rely on historical planning processes and requires them to maximize flexibility, even as budgets and resources diminish.   

This uncertainty isn’t necessarily bad news for the creative and agile marketer. After all, disciplined belt-tightening can allow marketing leaders to reflect, establish new ways of working, and find creative ways to deliver maximum value with their current resources.   

As marketers look to close the year strong and head into 2024 planning, we’ve identified seven critical steps marketing organizations should take to strategically balance and blend brand and demand marketing agendas and inform next year’s planning efforts that are fast upon us. 

1. Translate Business Objectives Into Quantified Customer Goals  

The first and most important part of doing more with less is to remain diligent in driving business outcomes with a customer-focused lens. All activity should point directly at delivering business value for the short and long term. Ensuring you have customer-focused goals based on acquisition, retention, cross-sell and upsell and making your brand worth paying more for is the foundation to maximize resources.   

Once you have set your goals, you must regularly track and align your efforts to the business outcomes your organization expects marketing to influence or drive. To do this, we recommend developing a leading and lagging metrics ladder and establishing quarterly check-ins with your team. By doing so, you will know what is working in your marketing plan and feel more confident that every element of your marketing budget is maximized and driving ROI. And if you notice that marketing efforts are underperforming, you’ll be in a better position to quickly pivot your efforts.  

Learn more on how you can anchor your marketing activities and investments in business outcomes in our global research report, Brand and Demand: A Love Story.  

2. Do Fewer Things 

Peter Drucker famously wrote, “Management is doing things right. Leadership is doing the right things.” The same is true with marketers. Every dollar works as hard as possible, but the success of your budget is dependent on whether you invested those dollars appropriately, which is why marketing leaders need to prioritize growth opportunities and continuously analyze and optimize to ensure those efforts are practical and efficient.  

Obvious, right? But in a world where specialists and digital marketing skills are at a premium, many companies are overspending to build executional muscle in modern marketing tactics. But while they are actively improving their search and social skills, for example, they may lose focus on why they are in those channels in the first place. 

Companies can do more things right by doing fewer things and staying laser-focused on driving business outcomes and customer goals. Before greenlighting any initiative, even small ones, you must ensure they support those goals. When calculating the cost of your marketing efforts, measuring the cost in dollars and the resources and time your team needs to invest in executing is critical.   

Here are some key questions to help marketers prune the marketing calendar. If you’re feeling advanced, you can build a scoring system to help you prioritize.  

3. Prioritize Moments That Matter Most in Your Customer’s Journey 

As our Brand and Demand: A Love Story report noted, journey-based planning has become critical in the digitally driven marketers’ toolbox. However, as marketers adopt this concept, many need to work harder to make the most out of every moment in the journey, which spreads resources too thin and splinters impact.   

Studying the journey keeps organizations customer-centric and uncovers opportunities. But to maximize usefulness, marketers must decide on the most critical barriers to address and seize opportunities to build out the signature and memorable moments. 

Prioritizing the moments that matter the most in the customer journey calls for tough choices, especially when you need to do more with less. Marketing leaders prioritizing customer acquisition will likely lean toward awareness and consideration moments, while those focused on retention and loyalty will probably lean toward post-purchase moments. One thing to note when prioritizing these moments is to make a list of those that you are choosing to ignore now. Eventually, marketing budgets will increase again, and the moments you deprioritize can be revisited.   

Once you have prioritized your moments, you must ensure your teams leverage these moments for brand and demand opportunities. After all, doing more with less is sometimes doing two things simultaneously! By doing so, it will be easier for your team to make the right choices about the appropriate channels, experiences and messages you need to serve your customers and, at the right time, to drive results for your organization. 

4. Sharpen Your Value Propositions- Superiority That Matters 

To stay relentlessly relevant and earn customer respect and loyalty, strong brands must deliver meaningful, purposeful connections that appeal to people’s emotions with distinctive brand Purpose, Promise and Principles. At this point, many brands clearly understand why they exist and what they do. Still, in this low-spending climate, where every dollar counts, brands should revisit how they think about functional benefits, quality and superiority claims.  

When budgets and resources are constrained, it is a best practice to revise and sharpen your demand-based value proposition at the umbrella brand and product level, ensuring that product-level promises are crisp, compelling and competitive.  And, even more than that, based on things that your target audience can experience. Superiority in the lab or around the margins is one thing, but superiority that people can see and feel, that makes a real difference is another thing. Weaving those promises to reinforce and inform the brand story, and vice versa and ensuring that they are reflected across all in-market executions can boost short-term revenues, even as they support long-term brand health.   

Revisiting your value proposition may mean returning to tried and true basics while challenging assumptions within your organization. It can also result in your team reconsidering old-fashioned benefits and features to sharpen your customer value story, which should evolve and grow as your customer needs change. 

As you do so you should think through these critical questions: 

  1. What are the specific tensions, meaningful benefit pillars and proof points that are critical to deliver on the brand promise?  
  2. Do these need to change for different customer audiences?  
  3. How can we uniquely deliver superiority that matters to customers?  
  4. Are our proof points ownable and tangible?
  5. Are the brand and demand value stories tightly interwoven? 
  6. How can you test and learn before market scaling? 

5. Give Your Creative Assets a Make-over  

In recent years, much of the focus for marketers has been on where and how communications are delivered. It’s impressive how far many have come as they build expertise in performance marketing, owned and earned media, SEO and SEM.   

But many people forget that data shows the success of a campaign is dependent on the quality of the creative. Brilliant campaign ideas and breakthrough experiences are a must-have. Creative work at every point in the journey needs to be branded and rooted in demand-based product truths. It’s not enough to love an asset on the drawing board. It has to stand out in the specific context in which people will discover it. 

During times when you need to do more with less, it’s a good step to build upon your basics. Below is a sampling of a few ways you can do this: 

  • Add more demand marketing strategies to your top-of-funnel efforts. 
  • Dial up your brand messaging during the purchasing stage of your customer’s journey.  
  • Sweat your call to action (CTA). You should vet and optimize your CTAs, even if you’ve used them a million times.  
  • Ensure every experience and touchpoint leads your customers to the next milestone in their journey and propels them to the conversion and loyalty stages.  

On a side note, many marketers are integrating AI into their creative process to drive efficiency in their process and execution. We will touch on this more below. 

6. Leverage AI to Do More With Less

AI and machine learning, have played a critical role for marketers for several years. After all, both power programmatic buying, personalized messaging, predictive analytics, buy-now recommendations and chatbots.   

But, with the recent rise of ChatGPT and generative AI tools, businesses have begun experimenting with new ways to increase productivity and effectiveness. It’s becoming clear that the marketing teams that leverage AI tools can magically add more hours to their days.   

While we are at the beginning stages of this new evolution of generative AI, we have identified four key areas of AI that can help support your marketing efforts and teams today. 

AI is evolving fast, and marketers must remember that what they learned last week is outdated. Yet even in its infancy, it has the potential to save money, free up hundreds of hours and improve effectiveness. 

7. Elevate Scenario Planning  

It sometimes feels like we are working in patchy fog. Will the “vibecession” give way to a real one? Will do more with less  be the bumper sticker for just a few more quarters or the foreseeable future? No one knows. But effective scenario planning can mean the difference between simply surviving unexpected curveballs or thriving because of them. It’s the difference between mourning and moving.  

People often think of scenario planning as dealing with the long-term future for outcomes that are years away. But why not use it for the near term to proactively address scenarios that may jeopardize the ability to reach any prioritized goal? It can even be used at the level of an individual initiative to ensure quick response to in-market performance.  

Think of scenario planning as a game. A game board like the one below can be used to help with thinking ahead on owned-asset performance. We recommend building a cross-disciplinary team to scenario plan for your next launch, campaign or initiative. You can use this gameboard to strategize how you might react to potential scenarios, such as shifting media spending, changing messaging or revisiting content and social strategies.   

From there, teams can think about how best to codify and socialize the contingency plans, including the owners of levers. 

The job isn’t over when the game board is completed. Identifying when, how and who is responsible for tracking and implementing is critical. Additional cross-functional planning sessions can allow follow-up on hot topics and assign owners to chosen levers.   

Learn more about scenario planning in our recent AMA article. 


Instead of thinking about doing more with less as negative, think of it as a path to unlocking uncommon growth. By intensifying customer-centricity, doing fewer things, focusing on moments that matter, sharpening value propositions and befriending AI, marketers can navigate the challenges of constrained resources and emerge stronger. These back-to-basic exercises increase impact, build resilience, and pave the way for meaningful long-term growth. Interested in learning how you can do more with less? Contact Kate Price or Mat Zucker to get started.  


Brand and Demand: Amy Scissons on Building Agile Marketing Organizations

Mat Zucker, Senior Partner at Prophet, speaks with Amy Scissons, Chief Marketing and Communications Officer at Russell Reynolds Associates, on the importance of building an agile marketing organization.  

Amy Scissons is the Chief Marketing and Communications officer at Russell Reynolds Associates, overseeing global marketing and communications for the leading executive search and leadership advisory firm.  

Scissons previously was at Mercer, where she served as Chief Marketing Officer and led marketing operations in more than 100 cities and 41 countries for the global human resources consulting firm. She brings over 20 years of experience across several industries and global markets. Scissons specializes in integrated marketing, demand generation, customer-centric digital and data-driven marketing and leading high-performance teams.  

Mat Zucker: Given the disruption of the last few years, marketers are often being asked to take on greater accountability to demonstrate immediate impact and ROI of marketing investment while creating tighter alignment with the business outcomes. Has that been your experience? If so, how have you shifted your strategy to show impact? 

Amy Scissons: The expectations around marketing delivered ROI have evolved since taking the role. Previously, this role was focused on communications and driving colleague engagement, but now it’s shifted to driving topline growth for the firm while carving out greater differentiation within the market. In particular, professional services and leadership advisory is a relatively homogeneous marketplace as we deliver similar services to our competitors. Differentiation is key to ensuring we continue to win in the market.  

To measure our impact, we look at marketing-attributed revenue, particularly inbound leads driven by digital or other channels. We also look at how effectively we sell differentiated service bundles tied to our client needs. To measure the success of our business development enablement, we look at win rates and the service portfolio’s overall growth.  

MZ: Within your organization, how do you partner with other internal business units and teams to unlock new opportunities for driving growth? Has this evolved in recent years?   

AS: Growth opportunities are a shared responsibility among business development, strategy and marketing. For example, our strategy team will identify organic growth opportunities. At the same time, our client-facing colleagues will highlight new business challenges our clients face, while marketing will use data and digital to identify new growth opportunities based on engagement. We collectively evaluate them as an organization and action them accordingly.  

MZ: Last year, we published a report, “Brandand Demand Marketing: A Love Story,” which speaks to the tensions between brand and demand marketing and why working in silos harms performance. Both are critical functions that need to work together to enable success. How do you balance brand and demand within your marketing organization?  

AS: Within our marketing and communications organization, we made a significant shift to our operating model and chose to build out more specialized roles within the team. This shift has changed how we can execute and the speed at which we can deliver. As a result, we are becoming much more creative in presenting our insights and data, which gives executives ways to interact with our insights and take them to the boardroom. For example, we may not always win the thought leadership topic game, but we can win on how we deliver our thought leadership. By shifting how the team is structured, we’ve become more agile, allowing us to do some brand, demand, and business development enablement work.  

MZ: Now that you have this new operating model in place, are people still wired in the old way, hybrid, or have they fully embraced this new way of working? 

AS: Yes, we have adapted nicely to the new way of working, though it took time to map out workflows and ensure team members trust one another to deliver their part of the work. The briefing process is key every time we take on a new project. We establish the “why” of our project and challenge ourselves to think of creative ways to deliver the work.   

MZ: What kind of feedback do you get from your people regarding their careers and where they are in their journey? 

AS: We are a relatively new team. We are in our second full year as a fully formed marketing leadership team. We are all excited about the work we are doing. I give my team a lot of autonomy and space to innovate. Some of them are interested in AI, so they have dedicated time to play around with these tools. With AI, I’ve told them first to find a really small way to use it so that they can show the organization that we are thinking about it. The team quickly came up with the idea to build screensavers with our logo using AI, and now our consultants have this up on their desktops. Little things like that help build energy around innovation and move the organization forward, which excites the team. It feels like a small thing, but it gives people permission to experiment.  

MZ: Our research found that experimentation and a test-and-learn mindset are not nice to have but a must-have because if you only use benchmarks to measure success, you will fail. How does this concept sit with you? 

AS: I 100% agree. We do things we would never think to invest in as experiments and are always surprised to see the growth and opportunities that emerge. For instance, our Redefiners  podcast has been incredibly successful, but we did not predict that would be the case. I never thought we would see 25,000 downloads per episode in the first or third season. And because of this test, our podcast has become a successful investment in the Russell Reynolds Associates brand and is now a fully operational demand-generation tool.  

Test and learn is built into how we work. Some tests did not perform that well. For example, we thought this really cool digital pitch tool would completely change our win rate, but it didn’t, so we pivoted and killed it quickly.  

MZ: What big takeaway do you want to share with other CMOs and marketing leaders?  

AS: Creating an environment and a team that can be very agile is incredibly important, but you need to make sure you also have the right technology to support it. After all, much of your budget goes to your marketing technology stack. Having the right operating model is also important. You need to create a model that enables your marketers to work and act differently and not get stuck in the ways of working that are not working. It’s essential to challenge the organization, innovate, do things competitors aren’t doing and let ideas come from everywhere. Because my team is so agile, we can act on and respond to new ideas and bring them to market faster. 

MZ: What are the biggest challenges you believe other CMOs and marketing leaders face today and will continue to face in the next few years? 

AS: I am convinced that marketing is going through a massive disruption. AI will transform marketing, and the marketers who understand how to use AI, develop prompts and put them in workflows will see a lot of success. The challenge with the CMO role is that it is very broad and has high expectations. You only have a little time to think, transform, and drive change. But the CMOs and marketing leaders who figure out how to use AI in their workflows will be more productive and thrive.  

About Mat Zucker 

Mat is a senior partner and co-lead of Prophet’s Marketing and Sales practice. He helps clients transform digitally, finding new areas of growth in marketing, content and communications. Previously, Mat was the Global Executive Creative Director at Razorfish, served as Chief Creative Officer at OgilvyOne New York and held leadership roles at R/GA and In addition to helping clients creatively connect and engage with their customers, he hosts two podcasts, Cidiot and Rising.   

Are you interested in talking with Mat? You can contact him, here


In our new series, Brand and Demand: The Interviews, Prophet experts sit down with CMOs and marketing leaders who are unlocking demand, driving uncommon growth and building relentlessly relevant brands to get their takes on the top trends, challenges and opportunities they face in today’s disruptive world.

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